Curse

Thom Bangalter · Aug 17, 2006, 02:47 PM // 14:47

While observing and playing a lot of gvg matches, I've seen a ton of warriors running protector's strike on the bar. I'm not sure who originated this, the first player I distinctly remember running the skill was remstar the red, but that's a moot point....

The point is, which is superior on a bar? I'm a fan of bull's strike because it's obviously awesome (me likey knockdown) but protector's seems good as additional pressure. The question is, is bull's strike worth dropping? Protector's is much more spammable and scales very well, but the KD seems stronger imo.

Other people's thoughts?

JR · Aug 17, 2006, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Both?

Thom Bangalter · Aug 17, 2006, 03:12 PM // 15:12

where do you fit both in?
eviscerate/executioner's/bull's strike/heal sig/shock/rush/frenzy/rez.
I don't see room in the bar for both, unless you don't care about heal sig on the warrior for the possible split.

(and you edited my post JR, but you were the only person I wanted to see it anyway. This will probably dissappear too)

TheOneMephisto · Aug 17, 2006, 03:15 PM // 15:15

It seems to me like the old damage vs. utility thing. I personally like bull's strike just because doing a solo 6 sec KD is leet, but protector's can be very nice for pressure and damage, along with a 1/2 sec activation attack for the end of spikes.

yesitsrob · Aug 17, 2006, 03:39 PM // 15:39

they both rock, immensely - i don't think you can go far wrong with either, but since you tend to _have_ to choose between the 2, then I'd say bull's strike, simply for the knockdown. And the fact that combined with shock you can shutdown anyone for a good few seconds

It's a pretty nice choice to have to make though

Farin · Aug 17, 2006, 04:38 PM // 16:38

I'm a fan of Bull's strike. Being able to pull a 6 second knock lock on a monk with Bull's Strike and Shock is priceless. There's a lot of times where I've solo killed monks with an axe warrior.

Prot's strike is of course more damage. You can use Prot strike instead of frenzy like Im A Paladin does but I feel weird without it

.

Wasteland Squidget · Aug 17, 2006, 06:33 PM // 18:33

Really depends on your goal with the warrior. Bull's Strike is a nice anti-kiting skill and allows you to quickly and disruptively build up adrenaline. Protector's Strike adds nicely to your damage in a spike. A lot of people seem to think the value in Protector's Strike is in the damage to moving foes, but it's really all about the 1/2s cast time. Dealing an extra full-damage swing without having to wait for the next attack is a pretty impressive effect. The damage to moving foes is just a bonus (albeit a pretty good one.)

As far as how to run both, remember that you probably don't need Heal Sig on every single warrior, though it's nice to have at least one in a build. We've run a warrior before that looked like this...

Pressure Axe Warrior
Axe Mastery 16 (12 + 3 + 1)
Strength 13 (12 + 1)
Zealous Weapon

-Eviscerate {E}
-Executioners Strike
-Bull's Strike
-Protector's Strike
-Wild Blow
-Distracting Blow
-Rush
-Res Sig

This character plays pretty differently from the normal warrior. Since he lacks Frenzy he doesn't work at all well if you're trying to spike, but he's better than almost anyone at single-target pressure and disruption. Distracting Blow allows him to take out a lot of crucial skills from whatever target you stick him on (Aegis, Heal Party, Deep Freeze, ect.) Permanent Rush and Bull's Strike make him incredibly difficult to effectively kite. Eviscerate + Executioners + Protector's is also a very nice combo, though you have to be careful since you're using it without an IAS. Skills like Distracting Shot can be dangerous.

Paladin of Te runs something similar. He's where we stole the build from.

Anyway, every skill needs to be weighed on its own merits against all the other skills on your bar. If it really came down to just running one or the other, I find Bull's Strike slightly more useful.

yesitsrob · Aug 17, 2006, 07:35 PM // 19:35

I think Paladin used lacerating chop too, to cause bleeding after a knockdown, it was pretty cool to watch, Personally, I'd feel naked without Frenzy

Greedy Gus · Aug 17, 2006, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Yup, prot strike slides into the frenzy slot. The amazing synergy is with rush, even better than bull's strike synergizes with rush. With rush as your only stance, you'll soon be hauling ass around the field constantly. The bar that pally runs is sick because with 13 strength, prot strike on a moving target is nearly as much +damage as evis or executioners. You absolutely are able to devastate kiters, because you're faster than them and have prot strike and bull's strike to brutalize them with.

As for spiking, it's actually not so bad. Evis + protectors strike land before they can react really. And on someone knocked down (bull's or shock), you can do non-IAS Evis + Executioners/Lacerating + prot strike, all before they can get up and cast a single spell. Try this in RA, you can solo monks easily.

16 axe
13 str

Eviscerate {E}
Lacerating Chop / Executioner's Strike
Disrupting Chop / Distracting Blow
Protector's Strike
Rush
Bull's Strike
Shock / (I use endure here sometimes)
Res Sig

Ss Executioner · Aug 20, 2006, 07:03 AM // 07:03

I don't feel like a Warrior without frenzy... I tend to run Bullstrike on axes, and Prot strike on swords. The KD from Bullstrike is great, especially if your able to bullstrike just as you spike that target. Prot strike is nice too, however, yes it is spammable, but with the quick recharge and the energy cost, you are likely to start running out of energy quick.

Personally Ithink the KD is invaluable.

stueyman2099 · Aug 21, 2006, 05:31 AM // 05:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by SsExecutioner

I don't feel like a Warrior without frenzy...

It's definatly a different mindset from the adrenal spike warrior we've all grown to love, but don't underestimate it becuase it doesn't have the IAS, this guy is a total BITCH to have breathing down your throat.

twicky_kid · Aug 21, 2006, 05:46 AM // 05:46

I'd say it depends on your weapon. Axe and sword go with bull strike. Hammers go with prot strike.

Another good point to prot strike you can adrenaliine charge without using frenzy. Follow your attacks with prot strike and its charges you just as fast without the double dmg risk.

ubermancer · Aug 21, 2006, 06:34 AM // 06:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by stueyman2099

It's definatly a different mindset from the adrenal spike warrior we've all grown to love, but don't underestimate it becuase it doesn't have the IAS, this guy is a total BITCH to have breathing down your throat.

Agreed, I have monked against at least one particularly good Warrior who ran Bull's Protectors Sprint Eviscerate Executioners and Shock. I almost cried, could do nothing but stand there and take it.

nebuchanezzar · Aug 21, 2006, 07:31 AM // 07:31

With teams having a soak team at the flagstand often now disruption is more important. Add that he always(or should) have monk support and dropping HS isnt too hard. With smarter monks stopping when they see Bulls perhaps that has also given and extra push to Protectors in higher-level teams.
Hard to give up a KD skill though =].